Curse

Viruzzz · Nov 17, 2007, 11:34 PM // 23:34

I'll take a small map with something in it over a huge map with nothing in it.

EVE-online has the biggest map if you look away from the scale. but there is almost nothing in it. even when you get down to the solar system scale, there's barely anything in it. a few planets, moons, asteroid belts.

and then zoom further in and you get to the stations, ships, individual asteroids
and even then some ships are several hundred meters long, some of the biggest several kilometers.

the smallest guns in the game shoot around 500 meters, and that is pretty damn close in EVE-terms

Not that EVE is a bad game, i liked it when i played it. but the map size is overrated, since there's barely anything in it. although the game often gets credit as "biggest mmo world"
Although it should be mentioned that there isn't really any form of "instant travel" in eve, if you want to go somewhere you have to go through each and every solar system on the way, and that certainly adds quite a bit to how big the map feels.

there are plenty of games like guild wars though, with a relatively small map, and an entire continent only houses 5-10 towns/cities

chowmein69 · Nov 17, 2007, 11:43 PM // 23:43

interesting indeed

Biostem · Nov 17, 2007, 11:52 PM // 23:52

Just a general comment: doesn't it seem odd that there are all these animals, raiders, demons, etc wandering around, yet somehow civilization manages to stay intact? Where are the farms necessary to maintain these populations, and the ones we do see are inexplicably left alone by such malevolent forces. Furthermore, where are the shipyards, quarries, and vast logging crews to provide the raw materials?

Yes, I know it's just a game, but it still bugs me that you don't see 100's of acres of farmland (1000's, even), or the large grazing flocks, etc.

Dirty Savage · Nov 17, 2007, 11:54 PM // 23:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by cellardweller

Best guru thread ever.

I second that motion

creelie · Nov 18, 2007, 12:03 AM // 00:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biostem

Just a general comment: doesn't it seem odd that there are all these animals, raiders, demons, etc wandering around, yet somehow civilization manages to stay intact? Where are the farms necessary to maintain these populations, and the ones we do see are inexplicably left alone by such malevolent forces. Furthermore, where are the shipyards, quarries, and vast logging crews to provide the raw materials?

Yes, I know it's just a game, but it still bugs me that you don't see 100's of acres of farmland (1000's, even), or the large grazing flocks, etc.

You might as well ask where the unending hordes of monsters come from. Every time you step out the door it's like you never went out killing them in the first place!

Sleeper Service · Nov 18, 2007, 01:09 AM // 01:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk

Wasn't Daggerfall (or Arena?) randomly generated?

from what i recall of it at the time (a very long time ago now lol) some of it was.

the dungeons ended up being insane crazy mazes...that looked the same. Still it was awesome for the time.

EVE is a space mmorpg, and space does consist of a lot of empty uh...space.

however theres always something going down somewhere, and there are the equivalent of "dungeons" with "rooms" that you can access in systems to do quests and such.

it can get quite busy. but granted its totally different. size and scale etc

Biostem · Nov 18, 2007, 01:17 AM // 01:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by creelie

You might as well ask where the unending hordes of monsters come from. Every time you step out the door it's like you never went out killing them in the first place!

You're absolutely right. It's funny (sad?) how i get hung up on stuff like that, but it's perfectly acceptable to sling lightning bolts and fireballs around.

Terra Xin · Nov 18, 2007, 01:51 AM // 01:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

Character steps are not a good starting point.

You should use the radar. The 'inside' of the radar is about 300meter wide.

300 meters? That cant be right. But I've always wanted to know something like this, nice work

Actually you know what's funny? Abaddon attempted to control what is actually a small peninsula of a much larger continent, lol.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biostem

Accounts are played on servers that are divided regionally, depending on the location of where the game was purchased; Europe, America, Korea, Taiwan or Japan. Players of Europe are able to switch freely from their region over to the American region, and vice versa.

I think Factions did the best it could in this area, with everyone crammed in Kaineng City and farmlands only on Shing Jea. I guess that's how we get [skill=text]Famine[/skill]

ensoriki · Nov 18, 2007, 02:27 AM // 02:27

*puts on gold shirt*
Stop. WTF time!

4 miles tall desert? Holy Attention hog!

I thought deserts were leveled areas that aren't very tall.

Let me just check wikipedia and-...Wikipedia says wtf Holy attention-hog!

Anyways use scorpion wire, since you need it to be 100 to activate.

That or the radar...but I guess thats been stated a couple times.

Croco Clouds · Nov 18, 2007, 02:29 AM // 02:29

Have calculate the uncertainty yet?

bilateralrope · Nov 18, 2007, 04:40 AM // 04:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Viruzzz

Not that EVE is a bad game, i liked it when i played it. but the map size is overrated, since there's barely anything in it.

There are also a lot of places where players might end up meeting each other. We are talking about player owned stations, NPC stations, asteroid belts, jump gates. While most systems only have a few of the later things, almost all the systems in Eve have over 10 moons, with some going over 50. Multiply that by several thousand systems and then you have a large number of places where players may interact.

Quote:

although the game often gets credit as "biggest mmo world"

Ok, lets ignore the physical size of the game world, since it isn't that useful a measurement. What other ways can we have useful measurments ?

Most MMO's divide the players onto separate shards/servers/realms because even if lag wasn't an issue, the game world can only handle so many people before crowding becomes an issue. For Eve Online everyone is on the same shard*. When I asked about players per shard elsewhere there weren't any MMO's that came anywhere near to the number of players per shard that Eve has.

*Well the Chinese have their own shard for some reason, but I'm ignoring it here.

The size of Eve's in-game economy is also impressive, though that may just be because I haven't got data about any other MMO's economy.

Operative 14 · Nov 18, 2007, 04:53 AM // 04:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by max gladius

from my... no idea why i am doing this... i got 9.5miles by 7 miles for the whole elona map... noob island 3.2mile by 2.8 miles... mainland mapable 5.5mile by 5.9 miles....

what i did was i ran a straight line (R key) on noob island, between north rez shrine by sunspear great hall, around the corner to the north, all the way south to the coast, got 20 dots, 2000 feet (center 1 dot to next is 100feet, see above notes). then i used photoshop measuring tool to figure the value for that distance, then measured map, did alittle math, converting, and got those numbers...

Very interesting Max, thanks for taking the time to do all the work on this.

It looks like we're taking two different tracks with our methods. I was trying to figure it out based on taking the average and disregarding the ingame distance scale and figuring it out based on our worlds relationships. It looks like what you're doing is using the games scale to measure the distance.
That would probably account for any discrepencies between our findings.

As far as the 88 foot aggro bubble radius; I was lying dead today while helping a guild member with the Gadds Encampment mission. I died from some nasty little critters, I forget the name. But, when they killed me and my portion of the party, they returned to the edge of where my Aggro bubble was. Considering my guild mate was AFK I had a bit of time to contemplate this.

What I did was I took my dead, prone, body and counted that as being 5'5" for easy rounding. I ended up with a number about 35 feet, but I can't remember the exact figure. So, at least based on that quick estimation, the Aggro bubbles radius is much smaller than the 88 feet quoted in the factions manual, and visually just looking at things at the edge of the aggro bubble this is pretty clear as well.

This possibly leads to the conclusion that the ingame Guild Wars (Tyrian) Foot is a smaller measurement than our Terran foot. That would explain the discrepencies between Max's figure and mine, and also some of the 'foot' measurements in the game not being quite what we might expect.

Issac · Nov 18, 2007, 05:28 AM // 05:28

Small world after all huh lol.

BoondockSaint · Nov 18, 2007, 07:33 AM // 07:33

Anyone measure how big Cantha is, or atleast the Dragon empire? I remember hearing that the emperor ruled over 250,000 subject, and then thinking, well thats not big, the CITY I live in has about that many people. I know that may have been big in olden times, but it would be intreasting to see what the size of Cantha is compared to its population, which I believe is the only place we know for sure how many people there are, and then campare it to say ancient Rome or something. Which at its hight had a million+ people.

Humm maybe I'm streaching too far but this is kinda of fun....

pumpkin pie · Nov 18, 2007, 08:06 AM // 08:06

Does anyone know where the highest peak in Tyria is?

I am trying to find my screenshot, can't seem to locate it.

Shanaeri Rynale · Nov 18, 2007, 09:19 AM // 09:19

Anvil rock is the highest point, by my recollection..

distilledwill · Nov 18, 2007, 12:57 PM // 12:57

Wow, you must've reached a new level of bored to have attempted this!

Still, this is pretty impressive. Kudos.

max gladius · Nov 18, 2007, 04:20 PM // 16:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoondockSaint

Anyone measure how big Cantha is, or atleast the Dragon empire? I remember hearing that the emperor ruled over 250,000 subject, and then thinking, well thats not big, the CITY I live in has about that many people. I know that may have been big in olden times, but it would be intreasting to see what the size of Cantha is compared to its population, which I believe is the only place we know for sure how many people there are, and then campare it to say ancient Rome or something. Which at its hight had a million+ people.

Humm maybe I'm streaching too far but this is kinda of fun....

funny u mention that, i am doing this as we speak, the trick is finding 2 spots u can see from big map, inline to each other for easy mapping and such...
also, love the name... best movie ever...

Alias_X · Nov 18, 2007, 06:03 PM // 18:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by EPO Bot

Is there someone who knows wich MMO world is the largest?

EVE Online. It has about a bajillion galaxies and star systems.

Iuris · Nov 19, 2007, 08:33 AM // 08:33

The larger the world in a computer game, the more watered down it feels. A universal truth.

I've played Daggerfall (one of my last pirated games, I just couldn't get an original in any way). The area was huge. But it was also absurdly bland - there may have been thousands of villages, but what help is that when the villages are just random clumps of buildings filled with people who are nothing but random name and surname combinations. Tens of thousands of dungeons, that are all simply random combinations of building parts.

The only really interesting areas were the ones that were specifically worked on (the palaces and similar).

Never mind the whole galaxies of Frontier: first encounters. LOTS of space. Little to see.

It's not the number of square miles that counts. It's the number of hours designers spent on the map. Elona may be small - but on every small map, you have a few sights, each of which is a story in itself. And that's what counts.